Their lighter weight makes moving panels around during installation a cinch, which is a far cry from the heft of conventional cement board. When cleaning thinset off of Schluter membranes, the manufacturer recommends using a wet sponge and taking care to avoid any scoring or inconsistencies on the surface of the membrane. In . Kerdi Board is suitable for a number of interior applications. Problem with very thick cement board/ tile/bullnose edge, Steam Shower Slip Joint Detail - The secret is in the boarding stage. Cross your fingers and hope it's all OK. Not the best Kerdi Showcase. Hello D Zak! If you can paint a wall, you can use RedGard. Will be doing a bathroom gut and will be laying durock cement board over plywood sub floor. However, the answer you provided above suggests that the OP could omit a waterproof membrane, that I. Once this is done, continue the installation by following the directions for the particular Kerdi product being used. You have to seal every little hole in the floor so the underlayment doesnt seep into spaces below. You peeled it off? What do you mean it doesn't adhere? What to use to flatten and prep wall before installing Schluter Kerdi membrane for tiling? Shouldn't take too long, maybe an hour or so. Jun 21, 2017. Hi.I have a unique situation. Seams and joints should also be waterproofed and caulked to prevent water from seeping through. It is lightweight and made of expanded polystyrene. If you are good with a trowel and understand how to set up and use screeds as a guide for leveling or forming the mortar, pouring a traditional mortar bed may be a good alternative to tile backer board, especially on uneven or sloping floors. Aquadefense is approved by IAPMO for use as a shower pan liner, but be sure to check your local building codes, as some areas of the country still require the PVC liner. It's still applied to cement board. Furthermore, if another trade, such as the shower glass installers, makes a mistake then you'll be . The bag says Mapei floortile mortar, it was the only unmodified thinset at our hardware store. . I've seen preferences regarding HardieBacker and the cement board products such as Wonder Board. PROBLEM SOLVED for Tub Flange when Installing Cement Board and Tile. Required fields are marked *. We recommend our users to update the browser. Step 3: Apply Thinset. The Kerdi membrane should be applied with the standard procedure, using a hogg brush or a notched trowel to spread the thin-set mortar and a roller to ensure appropriate adhesion. The surface of Wedi is perfect for bonding. Putting this stuff on walls is difficult and time . With that said, lets take a look at the importance of choosing the right tile substrate, the options you have, and which tile underlayment material you should choose Kerdi Board or cement board? Porcelain and ceramic tiles are stiff and hard materials, so if they are installed on an unlevel or bouncy surface they are highly susceptible to cracking. Sloped Shower Tray KST1220/1525 - The Home Depot. Browse other questions tagged, Start here for a quick overview of the site, Detailed answers to any questions you might have, Discuss the workings and policies of this site. There are many different types of underlayment to choose from, but they all serve the same purpose. Browse other questions tagged, Start here for a quick overview of the site, Detailed answers to any questions you might have, Discuss the workings and policies of this site. The niche' intermediate shelf isn't actually attached, to enable specific placement for each unique tiling application. We think it is the cement board (Durock) sucking the moisture out of the unmodified thinset. Not even the plumber's fault as it was just a bad valve. The mortar does . Since my guys and I will be doing this for the first time next week, I 'd like to take advantage of your 'learning curve.' It looks like you have Kerdi installed on the floor and not Kerdi Board. builder, anti-builder, rebuilder -- Retired Moderator. I also used a larger sized trowel than the one recommend by Schluter. Make sure to use multiple coats, if necessary. Installing cement board involves placing the boards atop a layer of thinset adhesive, a process known as bedding. Kerdi Board vs. Cement Board. I will say that to is easier to put the membrane over drywall than cement board. Yes, you need waterproofing behind shower tile. x 96 in. For the floor I make a dry mix mud base and then the Kerdi membrane. New England. It looks like Kerdi membrane is ~$2/sqft ($200 for a 108sqft roll) and kerdi board is $3.7/sqft ($115 for a 4x8 sheet (Lowes)). If you want a cement board, use Durock or Wonderboard. With cement board as a substrate, the key is to ensure proper installation of the membrane. We mixed the thinset, it wasn't as smooth as the utube video, but it was close, and we gave it ten minutes. Overall, putting Kerdi over regular drywall can be done, with the proper steps in place to properly install the membrane and its components. No, you do not need to install a vapor barrier, as Kerdi Board is the vapor barrier. GoBoard is a kind of backer board because the main elements of a backer board are cement, silica, fiberglass, etc. But you might be struggling to figure out what kind of paint to use on garage walls. Learn more about Stack Overflow the company, and our products. Additionally, if the cement board isnt waterproof, it can also cause mold and mildew issues, as well as dry wall damage from the moisture seeping through. This will include installing its components, such as drain plate and drain collar, as well as Kerdi Band for further protection of seams and corners. #4 You could be adding a good 1000 pounds to your install too. Putting this stuff on walls is difficult and time . I think the first one I used was cheap and that was part of the problem. One of the major benefits of opting for Kerdi Board over cement board is the ease of installation. The use of modified thinset adhesive could result in an inadequate bond and could lead to possible delamination. #3 This is a DIY site. Portland cement-based unmodified thin-set mortars are dependent on the presence of moisture for hydration in order to gain strength. It is important to waterproof Hardie board to make it more water-resistant, as well as to protect the materials from the elements. Its essential to protect surrounding wall and floor surfaces from water or moisture damage that can occur in these areas. Additionally, seal the space around any pipes and fixtures that can be found in the shower. Fiber cement board is a variation of cement board that is made from compressed cement and sand and reinforced with wood fibers throughout. They are available in thicknesses of 3/16, 3/8, 1/2, 3/4, 1, 1-1/2, and 2 (5, 9, 12.5, 19, 25, 38, and 50 mm). We just went through a learning curve on the Kerdi and Hardi. Installation; As the GoBoard is very lightweight, it becomes easy to . And for a more secure fit, you can also use screws. This liquid waterproofing solution does more than keep water away, it also promotes tile adhesion and prevents cracking. Cement board is known to be very heavy and somewhat difficult to cut. To line niche shelves, for instance. Well, DH said he had virtually no time to work with the stuff before it dried out, so he switched from my spritz bottle to a sponge. Needed to interject a little "amateur humor. Kerdi can even be installed over drywall. Make sure the floor is level in the shower. One of the major benefits of opting for Kerdi Board over cement board is the ease of installation. Installation is simple- just trowel a layer of thin-set adhesive on the floor and embed the mat in it, then fill the cavities with thin-set. This product is available in 3/16", 3/8", 1/2", 5/8" 3/4", 1" 1-1/2" and 2" thicknesses, allowing for a wide variety of installation options. Self-leveling underlayment has many of the same advantages as a dry-pack mortar bed but doesnt require as much skill to install. Installation instructions vary depending on the type of Kerdi membrane being used, but typically the membrane is applied directly to a clean, dry plywood surface that is free from dust, dirt, and other debris. I have to redo my tub surround due to moisture leaks and failing grout. To subscribe to this RSS feed, copy and paste this URL into your RSS reader. Yes, it is possible to put Kerdi over regular drywall. The perfect fold is tricky and many of my first steam showers where built without the sealed slip joint. Also - use a good thinset. Spacers are the next step. You probably have to go to a big box store's special order desk or find a specialty tile supplier to find it. Using self-leveling underlayment takes careful prep work. The core isnt waterproof, but it can withstand getting wet without falling apart, so even if your waterproofing system leaks, the board will stay intact. It is important to overlap the edge of the membrane so that it covers slightly more than half of the drywall behind it. Cement board comes both in 1/4-inch-thick and 1/2-inch-thick versions. Ditra is manufactured in a 3'3 width and comes in various roll lengths (54sf, 150sf, and 323 sf). x 48 in. It's a lightweight polystyrene board faced with Kerdi that comes in various thicknesses that you can use in place of drywall or cement board. To ensure that the Kerdi is completely dry prior to tiling, inspect the inside of the membrane for any signs of moisture or condensation. Important to overlap seams in a shingle method. The type of bonding mortar used to apply KERDI must be suitable for the substrate and must penetrate and engage the membrane fleece. A mortar wall is better and can be customized easier. In general, the Schlter system is typically more expensive than a cement board, and some people may find this an attractive option for its long lasting, easy to maintain qualities. Moisture resistant can cause similar problems, and there is absolutely no advantage to it. Why do small African island nations perform better than African continental nations, considering democracy and human development? It could take longer if the space is particularly wet or humid. Also, apply the acrylic mastic between the Create curved designs around pipes or columns using the vertically-grooved KERDI-BOARD-V, or use L-shaped KERDI-BOARD-E panels to enclose similar. Once the primer is completely dry, use a roller or brush to apply a coat of your chosen KERDI membrane adhesive over the entire surface of the wall, overlapping the edges slightly for full coverage. Cut the shower tray to size. All it takes is the right preparation. The main types of cement board you could encounter are Fibre Reinforced Cement (FRC) board and gypsum board. The grid lines on the surface are incredibly helpful for installation and making neat cuts. By: Author Olin Wade (Remodel or Move Stuff). If cement board had been used, most likely the damage would have been much less that what I have to deal with now. Allow the primer to dry completely before proceeding with the KERDI installation. Actually if you watch any pros work (not on crappy shows) on TV you will see them use backer board 99% of the time. Keep in mind that most tile setters err on the side of caution and brush a waterproofing membrane on top of cement board when it is in wet areas like showers or tub surrounds. When screwed to the framing, thin strips of cement board fracture more easily than thin strips of fiber-cement. Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers. It is also essential that cement board joints and fasteners be sealed and waterproofed with the Kerdi Fix sealant to help prevent water from leaking into the wall and floor cavities. DensShield is one common brand. There's a really great manual (with diagrams) that makes this all easier to understand. Various products can be used to waterproof shower walls such as water-resistant drywall and cement backer boards. Like the example above. As far as the tile/prep work, you are right that he is shifting the blame. A square foot of half-inch thick cement board weighs roughly 40 ounces, while the equivalent area of a Wedi board weighs about 75% less. First, felt paper is stapled to the floor and covered with expanded metal lath. Out of curiosity, why are any of you suggesting backerboard at all? The big issue with cement board is that the thinset will skin over really quickly. Re: Kerdi on shower curbs. What can a lawyer do if the client wants him to be acquitted of everything despite serious evidence? Is it ok to fasten a shower surround to Schluter Kerdi curb? I have corrugated metal shower surround & grab bars. Our thinset was more watery than the videos, but it still managed to dry out quickly, even in the time it takes to apply the small corners in our shampoo niche. Cement board is a bit better, but you need to spray either one before applying the mortar so that it doesn't "skin over" before you can get the Kerdi up. This is a very effective and popular method of installing tile, and one that ensures the tile doesnt crack. The site is called floorelf.com. Thanks to all for the feedback. It also features fleece webbing that allows for effective anchoring into thin-set mortar. Cementboard sufficient to a tub surround is dirt cheap .vs. Step 4: Place the Tile. Being a Los Angeles resident, Jessica spends a lot of her time looking for her next DIY project and sharing her love for home design. Start by cleaning the cement board with a mineral oil soap; this will help reduce mold and mildew growth throughout the life of the shower. I've never had a failure. En cliquant sur Accepter , j'accepte l'utilisation des cookies telle qu'elle est dcrite plus en dtail dans la Politique d'Utilisation des Cookies de Houzz. A.Sean Gerolimatos, technical services manager for Schluter Systems, responds: With a few exceptions, unmodified thinset mortar is required for setting ceramic and stone tile over Kerdi membranes (800/472-4588, www.schluter.com ), as well as for bonding overlapped seams and connections to Kerdi drains. Some being easier to work with than others. Kerdi-Board is an extruded polystyrene foam panel, with reinforcing material on both sides, covered by fleece webbing for effective anchoring of thin-set mortar. Kerdi membrane can be used on cement board, drywall, and, as you may have guessed- greenboard. Kerdi membrane prevents water damage and mold development. Yes, KERDI membrane will stick to cement board. rev2023.3.3.43278. No bulges either, but definetly no thin spots.-Not paying attention to the direction of the comb. Seems like I've been using the full measure of water the bag calls for, plus about 10%.-50 lbs of thinset at a time is too much for an amatuer. However if installed on drywall it is only protecting one side. Regardless, cement board is a great, trusted tile substrate that will work well on both walls and floors. I used 1/2 Hardibacker board over the studs and then used the Kerdi membrane over the Hardi. Stack Exchange network consists of 181 Q&A communities including Stack Overflow, the largest, most trusted online community for developers to learn, share their knowledge, and build their careers. On top of that, fiber cement board is even more brittle than standard cement board, so you have to be extra careful to keep screws at least an inch from the edge to avoid breaking the board. Water-resistant gypsum board, or green board, was used in the past as a tile backer but is no longer recommended, mainly because better products are available. if you go with vapour barrier, then cement board. Schluter SET, ALL-SET, FAST-SET or an unmodified thin-set mortar must be used to construct all KERDI seams to ensure watertightperformance of the system. Project Type: Tile / Category: Bathroom. Why are Suriname, Belize, and Guinea-Bissau classified as "Small Island Developing States"? x 60 in. Kerdi 3 ft. 3 in. Sweeby-Can you clarify- I undestood that the thinset would tend to dry out from the thirsty hardi or skim over from the air; so how does booking the Kerdi help with the first? I trust it and have never had a callback. It worked well - just like wallpapering. In jobsite conditions and over a long time, who knows. Plus, if you use the mold and moisture resistant drywall, it will be extra insurance against mold. Kerdi-Shower-T/-TS/-TT is a prefabricated sloped shower tray with integrated Kerdi waterproofing. Schluter Kerdi-Shower-T/-TS/-TT 48 in. 173 upvotes. The drywall's back side fails, and it's just as bad or worse than it was on the tile side. The cement board needs to be clean, free of debris, and dry. If you want to go to the extra effort of putting the membrane over drywall, there is no need to use greenboard. Cement board is a heavy mess compared to drywall, and drywall is a heavy mess compared to Kerdi Board. The major drawback to cement boards is their weight, as they are incredibly heavy and can be difficult to cut. Additionally, the drywall should be primed with a latex primer before applying the Kerdi membrane. Thinset with a latex acrylic modifier is best for interior projects, but if youre installing outdoors, you should use thinset with a polymer modified (PM) compound for greater moisture resistance. Both Kerdi Board and cement board are designed to smooth out uneven spots on the installation surface, create an unbending layer that wont flex underfoot, and also provide a waterproof barrier. This will help protect the cement board from water damage, and is often a specific type of coating designed for use with cement boards. Learn more about Stack Overflow the company, and our products. But a mortar bed does have advantages. Following the correct application of Kerdi membrane over cement board will ensure a successful waterproofing installation and lasting results for your tile project. (3ft-3in wide)Or will the Kerdi membrane (with seams taped with kerdi band) prevent each board from moving . I'm thirsty. After priming, use an approved adhesive to adhere the KERDI membrane to the drywall, making sure the edges are well sealed and joints are tight.if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[468,60],'remodelormove_com-medrectangle-4','ezslot_12',156,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-remodelormove_com-medrectangle-4-0'); A successful installation of KERDI requires well-prepared surfaces and a proper application, so take the time to properly prime the drywall before installation. Continuing Education for Architects & Designers. We tried adding water to the thinset, we tried using a larger notch trowel, but nothing seems to make the Kerdi stick. DIYers on this forum seem to have nothing but problems with Hardi. We are no longer supporting IE (Internet Explorer) as we strive to provide site experiences for browsers that support new web standards and security practices. The best answers are voted up and rise to the top, Not the answer you're looking for? He would take his rough opening measurement and subtract the thicknesses of the tile, the cement board, and in his unique install method the purpleboard. Yes, it is recommended to waterproof cement board, especially if it is going to be used in exterior settings or in places where it will be in contact with water. All it takes is the right preparation. As fiber cement board is similar to regular cement board, it makes sense to choose the one that is cheaper or more readily available. Do the prefab Schluter niches like the double unit 12 by 28shelf have a built in pitch to the bottom and middle shelves to drainoff water as shown in niche that you built in that thread? Kerdi board is a kind of waterproofer because these kinds of boards are made of XPS foam. Here's how to get it right the first time, If you've got a steady hand, a few easy-to-find supplies and patience, you can install a tile backsplash in a kitchen or bathroom, Step 4 in swapping your tub for a sleek new shower: Pick your waterproofing materials and drain, and don't forget to test, Work with your contractors and installers to ensure a safe, stylish curb that keeps the water where it belongs, Get the benefits of a time-honored ritual without firing up the coals, thanks to easier-than-ever home steam systems, Landscape Architects & Landscape Designers, Outdoor Lighting & Audio/Visual Specialists, Out With the Old Tile: 8 Steps to Prep for Demolition, Convert Your Tub Space Into a Shower Waterproofing and Drainage, Steam Showers Bring a Beloved Spa Feature Home.

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